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Austinsevenfriends
Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Printable Version

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RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Chris KC - 21-09-2018

Sounds like play might be the issue here, but someone really ought to mention that timing gears were originally tolerance matched to each other, a mismatched pair could give trouble. No info here to suggest whether they are or not. There is a marking on the crankcase. I think it tends to be assumed these days that most are so worn it doesn't matter, but...

RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - borchi1 - 21-09-2018

(20-09-2018, 10:40 PM)Austin in the Shed Wrote:
(20-09-2018, 08:18 PM)borchi1 Wrote: Thank you, unfortunately after all checkings (camshaft is NEW with modified lifters, remade new at HIGH price) 
oil is also correctly coming, the play is 2-3mm at the flywheel which is definitely too much.

Is there someone that has a spare NOS timing gears for sale? Or which seller do you suggest?

seems they are not in the catalogue off the shelf anymore... Dodgy Dodgy
What do you mean ,Play at flywheel is 2-3mm ?
Have you had a new camshaft made ?
I can help you with new gears if you need them.
if i move the flywheel right and left, there is a play of 2-3mm and the timing do not move.
This is excessive play of the teeth of the gears.
Yes i have a new camshaft made from "Cazzaniga motori" that has been engineered there and they remade the oil pump gear
at pattern, plus all the usual spherical cam follower. Big and pricy job, but now i have a proper "race" camshaft, pigsty racing never
replied to my emails or phone calls.

If you can help me with the new gears i would like to buy a NOS set, i have a coil 1937 engine, can i have your email to contact you?
Here some photos of the remade camshaft with modified lifters, Old vs New (shiny one)


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RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Zetomagneto - 21-09-2018

(21-09-2018, 07:08 AM)borchi1 Wrote:
(20-09-2018, 10:40 PM)Austin in the Shed Wrote:
(20-09-2018, 08:18 PM)borchi1 Wrote: Thank you, unfortunately after all checkings (camshaft is NEW with modified lifters, remade new at HIGH price) 
oil is also correctly coming, the play is 2-3mm at the flywheel which is definitely too much.

Is there someone that has a spare NOS timing gears for sale? Or which seller do you suggest?

seems they are not in the catalogue off the shelf anymore... Dodgy Dodgy
What do you mean ,Play at flywheel is 2-3mm ?
Have you had a new camshaft made ?
I can help you with new gears if you need them.
if i move the flywheel right and left, there is a play of 2-3mm and the timing do not move.
This is excessive play of the teeth of the gears.
Yes i have a new camshaft made from "Cazzaniga motori" that has been engineered there and they remade the oil pump gear
at pattern, plus all the usual spherical cam follower. Big and pricy job, but now i have a proper "race" camshaft, pigsty racing never
replied to my emails or phone calls.

If you can help me with the new gears i would like to buy a NOS set, i have a coil 1937 engine, can i have your email to contact you?
Here some photos of the remade camshaft with modified lifters, Old vs New (shiny one)
Camshaft looks very impressive,what are it’s specifications, looks to have quite a log duration.
This cam is for a 2 bearing engine so I would venture to say not 1937 as that would be 3 bearing
engine.
You have obviously spent some serious money here, I am sure with help from others here you will 
get it sorted.Austin in the shed is an excellent Austin Seven engineer.
How much camshaft endfloat do you have,what is the clearance between the crank, and camshaft gears.
Interested to know the manufacturer of the crankshaft and rods.
As I mentioned before, do not run this engine with no load if you can avoid it, and use running in oil.
I had a look at your cam maker here http://www.cazzanigarm.com/en
Best Wishes Gene

RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Alan - 21-09-2018

Centre bearing of a 2 bearing engine cam is rollers, for a 3 bearing its a bronze bush.

RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - borchi1 - 21-09-2018

(21-09-2018, 08:45 AM)Zetomagneto Wrote:
(21-09-2018, 07:08 AM)borchi1 Wrote:
(20-09-2018, 10:40 PM)Austin in the Shed Wrote:
(20-09-2018, 08:18 PM)borchi1 Wrote: Thank you, unfortunately after all checkings (camshaft is NEW with modified lifters, remade new at HIGH price) 
oil is also correctly coming, the play is 2-3mm at the flywheel which is definitely too much.

Is there someone that has a spare NOS timing gears for sale? Or which seller do you suggest?

seems they are not in the catalogue off the shelf anymore... Dodgy Dodgy
What do you mean ,Play at flywheel is 2-3mm ?
Have you had a new camshaft made ?
I can help you with new gears if you need them.
if i move the flywheel right and left, there is a play of 2-3mm and the timing do not move.
This is excessive play of the teeth of the gears.
Yes i have a new camshaft made from "Cazzaniga motori" that has been engineered there and they remade the oil pump gear
at pattern, plus all the usual spherical cam follower. Big and pricy job, but now i have a proper "race" camshaft, pigsty racing never
replied to my emails or phone calls.

If you can help me with the new gears i would like to buy a NOS set, i have a coil 1937 engine, can i have your email to contact you?
Here some photos of the remade camshaft with modified lifters, Old vs New (shiny one)
Camshaft looks very impressive,what are it’s specifications, looks to have quite a log duration.
This cam is for a 2 bearing engine so I would venture to say not 1937 as that would be 3 bearing
engine.
You have obviously spent some serious money here, I am sure with help from others here you will 
get it sorted.Austin in the shed is an excellent Austin Seven engineer.
How much camshaft endfloat do you have,what is the clearance between the crank, and camshaft gears.
Interested to know the manufacturer of the crankshaft and rods.
As I mentioned before, do not run this engine with no load if you can avoid it, and use running in oil.
I had a look at your cam maker here http://www.cazzanigarm.com/en
Best Wishes Gene

Dear Gene, camshaft is for the 3 bearings, i have it mounted on a 1937 engine.
I can't be more focused on the specs as was done by the engineer, but they created also special
"Modern" pistons. The cam maker is not that, is this one:

http://www.cfmotori.it

Hope this helps for the future, it seems i just need some new timing gears as the whole engine
has been test benched and runs very well, dual carb setup

   

RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Ian McGowan - 21-09-2018

Thanks Alan, I had just realised my stupid error and deleted the post!!

RE: Timing gears /coil engine with noise - Dennis Nicholas - 21-09-2018

Timing gears......I think the usual check is to use feeler gauges to check the backlash between the teeth, both sides.
For example when getting new timing wheels for my Ford engined Reliant Scimitar one of our engineer suppliers used to ask for those readings and he would supply one of THREE different sizes he had made and in stock.  This was to allow for any variation between the centres being bored during manufacture. (for example the Ford backlash allowed in my V6 3 lit is 0.007" to 0.011 inches).  The 4 (8) required measurements were asked to be taken at 90 degs. of rotation to each other.
The cam and crank centres may vary in distance apart; the gear may not be concentric......
My backlash measured at 0.009" with the new timing gears in the Ford engine and they are nice and quiet.
 As said above the 7 gears were selectively assembled in pairs and marked as pairs.  (someone somewhere suggested that Austin 7 engineering was simple basic non precision .......don't you believe it.....they knew what they were doing and were mostly good at it.)
 Does anyone have the official backlash figures for the 7 engine.?