Mounting front mudguards Rtc special

[Caddy1980]

Hi I’ve got to the point where I’m looking at fitting the mudguards on my special. The rears seem quite simple but when it comes to the front I’m at a bit of a loss. I have the TT cycle mudguards. Any photos of how others Have fitted cycle muddy would be greatly appreciated. 
Thanks in advance 
Aaron

[Howard Wright]

Hi Aaron

Here is a pic of the wing mounting on my special.  As yet untested!

The 1/4 BSF countersunk bolts pass through slightly enlarged rivet holes in the hub carrier. The tubular stays are set off the carrier with aluminium spacers shaped to sit tightly to the backplate.

Hope this helps?

Cheers

Howard

[Ian Williams]

Not wanting to be overly critical but you might need to revisit those stays Howard, when you flatten tubes straight across like that they often fracture from vibration stresses, especially as you will be trialing. I have mounted cycle guards with fabricated stays attached to the Radiator cowl and triangulated down to the cowhorns as per the TT cars and numerous others, if using this method remember that a stay across the inside of the cowl is needed to take the load's and reduce stress cracks in the cowl. A method Joss and I are using on our current specials is variation of the stay used by Austin for mounting Chummy and early saloon front guards, I suggest it is worth taking a look at this option depending on the style of your special. Joss has previously used this design to great effect on the Austin CMC Dieppe owned by Richard McWhannell, you should find pictures with a google search.

[Howard Wright]

Hi Ian

Thanks and no your not being overly critical just helpful as always. 

I’m not 100% happy with the flattened tubes either but do want to retain the hub mounting.  I was going to use square section tubes but they aren’t really “period“.  One answer may be to use round tubes but fit a solid bar in the end and shape the spacers to suit.

I think your wing supports are good but as mentioned I would like to keep the hub mount.  It seems “de-rigeuer” on later trials cars.

Aaron... Do note I said “untested” and Ian’s observation is very pertinent.

Cheers

Howard

[Michael D]

Methinks that first of all you'd have to decide wether or not you want those front cycle wings to move along with the steering (which has serious advantages when traveling on wet or muddy  terrain...) or not. If you'd want them 'steering' then you'd be condemned to fabricating some brackets that attach to the hub carriers or the backplates of the brakes which calls for serious abilities. Should you be happy enough with fixed fittings  then life could be easier.  Have a look at this tread https://www.austinsevenfriends.co.uk/for...hp?tid=707

I haven't got detailed pictures of the way the front cycle wings are mounted on my Rosengart unfortunately.. hope you can make something out of these

[Caddy1980]

Hi thanks everybody for the help! I’ll have a read through the link at lunch.
I do like the idea of the arches moving with the steering. I don’t have any brackets at all at the minute so I would need to fabricate something either way. Thanks again
Aaron

[Paul N-M]

Hi Howard and Aaron,
Each to his own of course and again trying not to be too critical but it would be a shame to spend a lot of time on a design for it to only fail and need a rethink. 
I dont think your (Howard) stays will last very long. They will fatigue at the mountings being tube. The assembly needs to be much stronger to cope with the vibration etc.
For trials work (Aaron) I can see the atttraction of covering the moving wheel but again there will be considerable impact and the whole assembly will need to be very strong and as a result heavy. Not ideal.
For what its worth I would go for a frame mounted design similar to the link in the thread. You can triangulate this reasonably well, as a result it does not need to be heavily engineered so retaining lightness and regidity and not puting extra weight and load on your hub/king pin and front end in general.
Just my observasions though.


Paul N-M

[Stumpi]

I have been using wheel mounted guards for many years  on my trials car,the ones on it were tube and failed as soon as i drove it .
I have two bosses welded on at 3 o'clock and 9 ,they have a bolt threaded into them from inside the backplate and tacked in place .this gives a stud to screw the brackets onto which are 25x5 flat bar.
The wings are alloy with a bead for extra rigidity.
At present they are hanging up in the garage as i painted them yesterday.
Planning to refit this afternoon and will try to post some pictures.
Andy

[Caddy1980]

Hi thanks again everyone.
I think I will have a look at some sort of frame mounts But would still be very interested to see other people’s versions of both. I guess there isn’t any pre made versions available?
Aaron

[Duncan Grimmond]

My experience of steering mudguards over the last 12 years has been variable. I discovered that most tubing fails unless it is solid drawn no welded seam material as used for hydraulic/pneumatic applications.it generally has a thicker wall and if the end is split to take a welded-in strip the ends last a bit longer.
Vibration cannot be " welded out" as the moment of the vibrating mudguard with the motion of the axle is inevitable. I've been using 15 mm tubing 1.5 thick wall with some success but failure is almost inevitable in my experience, most often on the attached 4mm strip. Owing to this weakness I've made guards and stays but not fitted them to my Pemblleton trike and am running with open wheels. When it rains you get wet.When or if I get stopped I'll fit them.
Definitely avoid mounting side lights on top of the guard!
My conclusion is that if you want a lightweight mudguard an "ailes de papillon" style is effective and least likely to cause embarrassing detachment at the most inconvenient moment.