Deep finned aluminium sump

[Derek Sheldon]

Does fitting a deep finned aluminium sump impede the fitting of a Opal engine ( is it inclined to catch up whilst fitting the engine) .
Can engine and gearbox be fitted in one piece with deep sump attached.
Thanks for your support.

[Speedex750]

Yes Derek you can do that with both the Nippy type and the slimmer Speedex/Dante type. The newer ones are slimmer again so should be OK but I've no personal experience of them. While an engine does come out and go back in, it can be more of a tussle with the extra dimensions compared to a tin sump. Coming out is the easiest of the two directions; lift the front of the engine until the sump clears the nosepiece and then slide it forward. Keep sliding until the gearbox clears the bulkhead and then get it to horizontal sitting on the nosepiece - then howk it out. Back in is more tricky. Tie a rope on the gearbox tail flange and have someone pulling on it. The engine and gearbox end up at about 30 degrees from horizontal to clear the bulkhead and the rope has to pulled hard to lift the rear until the sump drops behind the nosepiece.

Dave

[Ian McGowan]

Yes Derek you can do that with both the Nippy type and the slimmer Speedex/Dante type. The newer ones are slimmer again so should be OK but I've no personal experience of them. While an engine does come out and go back in, it can be more of a tussle with the extra dimensions compared to a tin sump. Coming out is the easiest of the two directions; lift the front of the engine until the sump clears the nosepiece and then slide it forward. Keep sliding until the gearbox clears the bulkhead and then get it to horizontal sitting on the nosepiece - then howk it out. Back in is more tricky. Tie a rope on the gearbox tail flange and have someone pulling on it. The engine and gearbox end up at about 30 degrees from horizontal to clear the bulkhead and the rope has to pulled hard to lift the rear until the sump drops behind the nosepiece.

Dave

My experience with the chummy suggests that the back of the head fouls the firewall before the finning clears the nosepiece. I ended up opening up the firewall (temporarily).

[Charles Levien]

Does fitting a deep finned aluminium sump impede the fitting of a Opal engine ( is it inclined to catch up whilst fitting the engine) .
Can engine and gearbox be fitted in one piece with deep sump attached.
Thanks for your support.

Derek, why do do you want a deep sump on your Opal?  

Charles

[Chris KC]

I run 'Nippy' aluminium sumps on both my Nippy and Ulster rep.
The engine won't go in (my cars) with the sump on - I drop it in without and then add the sump in situ. Which is a bit of a fiddle but do-able.

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Does fitting a deep finned aluminium sump impede the fitting of a Opal engine ( is it inclined to catch up whilst fitting the engine) .
Can engine and gearbox be fitted in one piece with deep sump attached.
Thanks for your support.

Derek, why do do you want a deep sump on your Opal?  

Charles

If I may throw in my tuppence worth, a 6-pint alloy sump is nice on a long run (basically storing spare oil in the pan rather than carrying it in the boot). Also imparts considerable stiffness to the crankcase I think.

It does take a mighty long time to warm up though. I recently measured oil temp over an hour and a half run, pootling down country lanes in Autumnal weather; it took over an hour to peak and then only at 64 C. You want to be really careful if you are the 'flying start' type. I haven't yet measured it under 'sportier' driving conditions (running in at present). It's widely held - on internet 'fora' (I read Latin too, and ancient Greek to boot) at least - that oil temp should be at least 90 - 100C in order to 'burn off' water, otherwise in conjunction with other combustion by-products it forms acid in your sump. I'm not 100% convinced about that but for sure the vast majority of engine wear / damage occurs with cold oil at start up.

[Rogerfrench]

Cast alloy stumps are helpful in preventing leaks, but the larger ones hold too much oil. Per Jack French, 60-odd years ago.

[Chris KC]

Cast alloy stumps are helpful in preventing leaks, but the larger ones hold too much oil. Per Jack French, 60-odd years ago.

Gosh the tin ones must leak something rotten Roger!

I wouldn't argue, it's too much oil. I hang on to mine because I keep the car for long continental runs more than sprinting about, I'm happy to warm up slowly and enjoy the confidence the extra capacity gives me on a full day's drive. Running dry worries me more than running cool. But then I'm running at 45 psi most of the time, which is not the case with most A7's I'd venture.

[Ruairidh Dunford]

I fitted a Dante deep sumped engine into a four seat Tourer last May - I left the gearbox off and removed the studs from the bellhousing.

It went straight into the chassis without issue, I then refitted the studs and gearbox.

[Zetomagneto]

I run 'Nippy' aluminium sumps on both my Nippy and Ulster rep.
The engine won't go in (my cars) with the sump on - I drop it in without and then add the sump in situ. Which is a bit of a fiddle but do-able.

---

Does fitting a deep finned aluminium sump impede the fitting of a Opal engine ( is it inclined to catch up whilst fitting the engine) .
Can engine and gearbox be fitted in one piece with deep sump attached.
Thanks for your support.

Derek, why do do you want a deep sump on your Opal?  

Charles

If I may throw in my tuppence worth, a 6-pint alloy sump is nice on a long run (basically storing spare oil in the pan rather than carrying it in the boot). Also imparts considerable stiffness to the crankcase I think.

It does take a mighty long time to warm up though. I recently measured oil temp over an hour and a half run, pootling down country lanes in Autumnal weather; it took over an hour to peak and then only at 64 C. You want to be really careful if you are the 'flying start' type. I haven't yet measured it under 'sportier' driving conditions (running in at present). It's widely held - on internet 'fora' (I read Latin too, and ancient Greek to boot) at least - that oil temp should be at least 90 - 100C in order to 'burn off' water, otherwise in conjunction with other combustion by-products it forms acid in your sump. I'm not 100% convinced about that but for sure the vast majority of engine wear / damage occurs with cold oil at start up.

Yes oil needs to get up to temp, I have often considered fitting a thermostat in the top hose to at least get the engine to a decent stable temperature.
The Pigsty, and other racing Sevens have an oil to coolant heat exchanger which obviously helps with getting the oil to temp quickly

[AustinWood]

I have a thermostat in the top hose (Renault 5). It works well and overcomes the tghermo-syphon overcooling in cold weather.
I have a shallow alloy sump. Extra rigidity and doesn't leak.