Con rod query

[Chris KC]

I do draw a certain comfort from the fact that our engines seem to survive more or less regardless of the choice of oil!

[Tony Press]

Hi Colin
All understood.  Yes much difference of opinions often expressed......sadly sometimes from old fashioned ideas that "that is what was recommended by the car manufacturer" without thought that oil has come on a long way since those days.  I too have done much research into the uses and qualities of the various types of oils and am sure you will probably have just as sore a head as I did at the end! But much enlightened.
I was referring to an additive that I use which does not alter the oil one uses but merely uses it to get carried around the engine/gearbox etc.  I have the lab test report on this additive from SINTEF (google it and you will see they are a very large and important oil industry laboratory) showing it does what the additive claims as does figures from MIRA tests.  In spite of these two august bodies findings the additive has been referred to by some as "magic of the wizard Merlin type".
I did actually venture across the border down to the former abode of M in Cornwall but unfortunately he was not at home so could not throw any enlightenment on why some thought it magic. 
A filter really is a good idea as an addition.

Dennis (in Devon)

I suspect you have misinterpreted the comments on this additive - the reference I remember was to the users believing the additive was magic - and that since Merlin was no longer alive this was unlikely.

I was going to say that this additive is very cleverly marketed but possibly it is not because if it was so good then all would be using it.

I know that it is sometimes said that the oil industry stops publicity of these amazing additives but after twenty years in the industry including chief engineer marketing for Mobil I remember a number of investigation which showed that extra additives gave no benefit and sometimes interfered with the standard additive pack.

Remember most oils now contain over 10% additives - all synthetic.

Users of the 'magic' additives are often hard to convince, having spent good money, so I will say no more.

---

I do draw a certain comfort from the fact that our engines seem to survive more or less regardless of the choice of oil!

Given that it is a design from the 1910's and in standard form is quite unstressed then a very basic lubricant should suffice.

[Dennis Nicholas]

Tony
Quote "I was going to say that this additive is very cleverly marketed but possibly it is not because if it was so good then all would be using it."

I know that it is sometimes said that the oil industry stops publicity of these amazing additives but after twenty years in the industry including chief engineer marketing for Mobil I remember a number of investigation which showed that extra additives gave no benefit and sometimes interfered with the standard additive pack". unquote.
                                        --------------------------------------------------------------------

1. There are more than you seem to think using it out there, many of them being very experienced engineers and builders of racing engines with figures published showing the improvements.
                                        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2. " .........remember a number of investigation which showed that extra additives gave no benefit and sometimes interfered with the standard additive pack".

Agreed that SOME were false
   BUT
The American Government prevented this additive inventors from advertising their claims and selling the stuff till they could substantiate their claims by an independent laboratory.  This they did through SINTEF. So the investigation showed that this extra additive did have the benefit claimed and it was allowed to be advertised and sold with the claims independently proven.
Also tests carried out by MIRA have come up with showing the same benefits.

You seem to be saying that the American Government were hoodwinked, also the SINTEF lab reports are false and that Mira have also got it wrong.   Highly unlikely.

In my own case of using the product, whilst I have not stripped any of my mechanicals and measured before and after use wear (as some have) and examined the surfaces under the microscope I can only go by the rather rough and ready comparison of mpg achieved before and after use. My mpg has shown a marked increase in both my Yeti 1.2 (petrol) and my Scimitar 2.8L (petrol) and also in my previous Scimitar 3 Lit (petrol).  The comparisons being done over many thousands of miles of before and after use in each case. This I believe shows the reduction of friction claimed. (I am a sad anorak that likes to record milage and fuel use for each of my cars.......it can sometimes be helpful in just showing a drop off of performance otherwise unnoticed.). 
 
Another user heavily involved with various VW variants took another path by taking sound measurements with a meter before and after using the additive.......his conclusion after finding all the after readings were lower was also that it was effective as claimed.......he also noticed smoother and better performance.(in several of his vehicles).

Your comment that a very basic lubricant should suffice in the 7 engine I find rather difficult to swallow.  I would only use a good quality oil so that the lives of the engine, gearbox etc. were made as long as possible and not prematurely worn out as will otherwise be the case.

Dennis

[Tony Press]

Tony
Quote "I was going to say that this additive is very cleverly marketed but possibly it is not because if it was so good then all would be using it."

I know that it is sometimes said that the oil industry stops publicity of these amazing additives but after twenty years in the industry including chief engineer marketing for Mobil I remember a number of investigation which showed that extra additives gave no benefit and sometimes interfered with the standard additive pack". unquote.
                                        --------------------------------------------------------------------

1. There are more than you seem to think using it out there, many of them being very experienced engineers and builders of racing engines with figures published showing the improvements.
                                        ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2. " .........remember a number of investigation which showed that extra additives gave no benefit and sometimes interfered with the standard additive pack".

Agreed that SOME were false
   BUT
The American Government prevented this additive inventors from advertising their claims and selling the stuff till they could substantiate their claims by an independent laboratory.  This they did through SINTEF. So the investigation showed that this extra additive did have the benefit claimed and it was allowed to be advertised and sold with the claims independently proven.
Also tests carried out by MIRA have come up with showing the same benefits.

You seem to be saying that the American Government were hoodwinked, also the SINTEF lab reports are false and that Mira have also got it wrong.   Highly unlikely.

In my own case of using the product, whilst I have not stripped any of my mechanicals and measured before and after use wear (as some have) and examined the surfaces under the microscope I can only go by the rather rough and ready comparison of mpg achieved before and after use. My mpg has shown a marked increase in both my Yeti 1.2 (petrol) and my Scimitar 2.8L (petrol) and also in my previous Scimitar 3 Lit (petrol).  The comparisons being done over many thousands of miles of before and after use in each case. This I believe shows the reduction of friction claimed. (I am a sad anorak that likes to record milage and fuel use for each of my cars.......it can sometimes be helpful in just showing a drop off of performance otherwise unnoticed.). 
 
Another user heavily involved with various VW variants took another path by taking sound measurements with a meter before and after using the additive.......his conclusion after finding all the after readings were lower was also that it was effective as claimed.......he also noticed smoother and better performance.(in several of his vehicles).

Your comment that a very basic lubricant should suffice in the 7 engine I find rather difficult to swallow.  I would only use a good quality oil so that the lives of the engine, gearbox etc. were made as long as possible and not prematurely worn out as will otherwise be the case.

Dennis

I didn't say poor quality oil !

As I noted above - I will say no more .

[JonE]

Austin splash fed shell bearings and rods have holes the same position as those shown in Terry’s photo.

can I just check - do standard 3-bearing shells come predrilled or does one drill the 4 of 8 via the factory rod drilling as per Terry's instructions earlier up the thread?

[Robert Leigh]

The shells I have used in the past were pre-drilled, but they were sold as Austin shells. Those who have experienced Reliant cranks and/or shells may know more.

[Jamie]

I am fitting new shells to my three bearing engine at the moment. I have had to drill oil holes as there was none. I used the oil holes in the connecting rods to get the holes in the correct place. I also had to drill new oil holes in new main shellls.

Regards,

Jamie.

[Chris KC]

I run Reliant rods in my car i.e. with fully floating gudgeon pins, and these have no oil holes.
The engine is pressure fed from the centre main so that may make a difference.

[Bob Culver]

I was intrigued to read that the last b.e on pressure cranks is drilled. I guess air in the galleries could take a long time to exit with thick cold oil and close clearances. From the Newnes book I notice that the BSA 9 hp engine had rolling bearings and was fed from one end with out circular ducts. Wonder how reliable these these were.