Pot & Trunnion Propshaft Repair?

[Dave Mann]

As AustinWood explained the spherical end of the carden shaft has to be a good sliding fit in the pot and I've not seen one like that for decades, most aren't spherical and can be thrown in from 100 paces. So I chopped the spherical end off and I used the splined end of a Hardy Spicer shaft, off a Triumph herald, the same size as a Seven. Both shafts were machined to the same diameter and a steel sleeve about 4" long machined to suit which was shrunk on the ends. The sleeve needs to be at least 1/2" wall thickness or it may slip as my mark 1 version did. And make sure you get the length correct.

[Tony Press]

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Please don't interpret this as a rant of any description (sang froid seems a bit scarce of late! Despite everything elsebeing jolly froid indeed).
However, I'm not (in this case, at least) interested in 'upgrading' the car, but in bringing it back to (something like) original Austin spec.
The balance between originality (conservation) and functionality ('improvement') is a tricky one and each of us treads his or her own path. And over time we may come to see things differently! Thus it has ever been. Equally I reserve the right at any point to suggest politely to another member that perhaps they are going too far - in either direction!
In this specific post though I'm trying to find out how to convert my car from a Hardy Spicer arrangement back to a fabric joint / pot and trunnion, warts and all! I enjoy actual vintage machinery...
Genuine thanks to all for their input.

I like to try and keep my cars (all pre 1930) in original condition, including  all changes introduced by later owners.

I have two with the fabric/pot joint tailshaft (with leather cover) and one converted to  Hardy Spicer.

In the 88 years of use I would think that many running parts would have been changed by owners keen to maintain their car, including replacing the tailshaft where the pot joint has worn badly (an  area where the cover can let road dirt in) .

With a damaged shaft, especially at the pot joint end I would be quite happy with finding and installing a good replacement rather than trying to repair. 

I am the third owner of a 1929 Australian bodied fabric saloon in what is now called 'oily rag' condition with the original light shaft engine (as confirmed by Gaydon ) plus a fabric and pot joint shaft and in its 77 thousand mile life I am sure there have been a few replacement parts, all part of its rich history.

Not sure oily rag is right for a fabric body !

Cheers, Tony.

[David.H]

Moth eaten??

---

Please don't interpret this as a rant of any description (sang froid seems a bit scarce of late! Despite everything elsebeing jolly froid indeed).
However, I'm not (in this case, at least) interested in 'upgrading' the car, but in bringing it back to (something like) original Austin spec.
The balance between originality (conservation) and functionality ('improvement') is a tricky one and each of us treads his or her own path. And over time we may come to see things differently! Thus it has ever been. Equally I reserve the right at any point to suggest politely to another member that perhaps they are going too far - in either direction!
In this specific post though I'm trying to find out how to convert my car from a Hardy Spicer arrangement back to a fabric joint / pot and trunnion, warts and all! I enjoy actual vintage machinery...
Genuine thanks to all for their input.

I like to try and keep my cars (all pre 1930) in original condition, including  all changes introduced by later owners.

I have two with the fabric/pot joint tailshaft (with leather cover) and one converted to  Hardy Spicer.

In the 88 years of use I would think that many running parts would have been changed by owners keen to maintain their car, including replacing the tailshaft where the pot joint has worn badly (an  area where the cover can let road dirt in) .

With a damaged shaft, especially at the pot joint end I would be quite happy with finding and installing a good replacement rather than trying to repair. 

I am the third owner of a 1929 Australian bodied fabric saloon in what is now called 'oily rag' condition with the original light shaft engine (as confirmed by Gaydon ) plus a fabric and pot joint shaft and in its 77 thousand mile life I am sure there have been a few replacement parts, all part of its rich history.

Not sure oily rag is right for a fabric body !

Cheers, Tony.

[Chris KC]

As AustinWood explained the spherical end of the carden shaft has to be a good sliding fit in the pot and I've not seen one like that for decades, most aren't spherical and can be thrown in from 100 paces. So I chopped the spherical end off and I  used the splined end of a  Hardy Spicer shaft, off a Triumph herald, the same size as a Seven.  Both shafts were machined to the same diameter and a steel sleeve about 4" long machined to suit which was shrunk on the ends. The sleeve needs to be at least 1/2" wall thickness or it may slip as my mark 1 version did. And make sure you get the length correct.

Thank you Dave

---

---

Please don't interpret this as a rant of any description (sang froid seems a bit scarce of late! Despite everything elsebeing jolly froid indeed).
However, I'm not (in this case, at least) interested in 'upgrading' the car, but in bringing it back to (something like) original Austin spec.
The balance between originality (conservation) and functionality ('improvement') is a tricky one and each of us treads his or her own path. And over time we may come to see things differently! Thus it has ever been. Equally I reserve the right at any point to suggest politely to another member that perhaps they are going too far - in either direction!
In this specific post though I'm trying to find out how to convert my car from a Hardy Spicer arrangement back to a fabric joint / pot and trunnion, warts and all! I enjoy actual vintage machinery...
Genuine thanks to all for their input.

I like to try and keep my cars (all pre 1930) in original condition, including  all changes introduced by later owners.

I have two with the fabric/pot joint tailshaft (with leather cover) and one converted to  Hardy Spicer.

In the 88 years of use I would think that many running parts would have been changed by owners keen to maintain their car, including replacing the tailshaft where the pot joint has worn badly (an  area where the cover can let road dirt in) .

With a damaged shaft, especially at the pot joint end I would be quite happy with finding and installing a good replacement rather than trying to repair. 

I am the third owner of a 1929 Australian bodied fabric saloon in what is now called 'oily rag' condition with the original light shaft engine (as confirmed by Gaydon ) plus a fabric and pot joint shaft and in its 77 thousand mile life I am sure there have been a few replacement parts, all part of its rich history.

Not sure oily rag is right for a fabric body !

Cheers, Tony.

Good for you Tony. Yes, I'm no stickler for originality, I just like to keep as close to the vintage spirit as I can. And as you say, sometimes owner mods need to be looked on as part of the story.

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I've never owned an original propshaft, Chris.  Can you tell me if the 'pin' is a machined part of the original shaft or is it an insert into the fore end of the prop?  Google doesn't seem to have any good close-up shots.

It would be nice to think that you could lathe up a piece of En36 and press it on.

I presume the pin is a sliding fit in the shaft, partly because replacement parts as such can be bought from our suppliers, and partly because I think you have to move the pin to fit the dust boot (according to Austin instructions). Though I confess when I looked at the one I own I wasn't too sure - if it was two pieces originally, it's one piece now!

[David.H]

As AustinWood explained the spherical end of the carden shaft has to be a good sliding fit in the pot and I've not seen one like that for decades, most aren't spherical and can be thrown in from 100 paces. So I chopped the spherical end off and I  used the splined end of a  Hardy Spicer shaft, off a Triumph herald, the same size as a Seven.  Both shafts were machined to the same diameter and a steel sleeve about 4" long machined to suit which was shrunk on the ends. The sleeve needs to be at least 1/2" wall thickness or it may slip as my mark 1 version did. And make sure you get the length correct.

Thank you Dave

---

---

Please don't interpret this as a rant of any description (sang froid seems a bit scarce of late! Despite everything elsebeing jolly froid indeed).
However, I'm not (in this case, at least) interested in 'upgrading' the car, but in bringing it back to (something like) original Austin spec.
The balance between originality (conservation) and functionality ('improvement') is a tricky one and each of us treads his or her own path. And over time we may come to see things differently! Thus it has ever been. Equally I reserve the right at any point to suggest politely to another member that perhaps they are going too far - in either direction!
In this specific post though I'm trying to find out how to convert my car from a Hardy Spicer arrangement back to a fabric joint / pot and trunnion, warts and all! I enjoy actual vintage machinery...
Genuine thanks to all for their input.

I like to try and keep my cars (all pre 1930) in original condition, including  all changes introduced by later owners.

I have two with the fabric/pot joint tailshaft (with leather cover) and one converted to  Hardy Spicer.

In the 88 years of use I would think that many running parts would have been changed by owners keen to maintain their car, including replacing the tailshaft where the pot joint has worn badly (an  area where the cover can let road dirt in) .

With a damaged shaft, especially at the pot joint end I would be quite happy with finding and installing a good replacement rather than trying to repair. 

I am the third owner of a 1929 Australian bodied fabric saloon in what is now called 'oily rag' condition with the original light shaft engine (as confirmed by Gaydon ) plus a fabric and pot joint shaft and in its 77 thousand mile life I am sure there have been a few replacement parts, all part of its rich history.

Not sure oily rag is right for a fabric body !

Cheers, Tony.

Good for you Tony. Yes, I'm no stickler for originality, I just like to keep as close to the vintage spirit as I can. And as you say, sometimes owner mods need to be looked on as part of the story.

---

I've never owned an original propshaft, Chris.  Can you tell me if the 'pin' is a machined part of the original shaft or is it an insert into the fore end of the prop?  Google doesn't seem to have any good close-up shots.

It would be nice to think that you could lathe up a piece of En36 and press it on.

I presume the pin is a sliding fit in the shaft, partly because replacement parts as such can be bought from our suppliers, and partly because I think you have to move the pin to fit the dust boot (according to Austin instructions). Though I confess when I looked at the one I own I wasn't too sure - if it was two pieces originally, it's one piece now!

Oily Rag : for fabric body try Moth Eaten 
David H

[Tony Press]

David H

Big moths ! 

Cheers, Tony.

---

As AustinWood explained the spherical end of the carden shaft has to be a good sliding fit in the pot and I've not seen one like that for decades, most aren't spherical and can be thrown in from 100 paces. So I chopped the spherical end off and I  used the splined end of a  Hardy Spicer shaft, off a Triumph herald, the same size as a Seven.  Both shafts were machined to the same diameter and a steel sleeve about 4" long machined to suit which was shrunk on the ends. The sleeve needs to be at least 1/2" wall thickness or it may slip as my mark 1 version did. And make sure you get the length correct.

Not sure I understand- do you have a sliding  joint in this hybrid tailshaft ?

Cheers, Tony.

---

I've never owned an original propshaft, Chris.  Can you tell me if the 'pin' is a machined part of the original shaft or is it an insert into the fore end of the prop?  Google doesn't seem to have any good close-up shots.

It would be nice to think that you could lathe up a piece of En36 and press it on.

The pot joint pin should be a press fit in the tailshaft ball- making it difficult to fit the rubber cover. I have used a copy of the original leather cover on the pre 1930's cars. 

Important as has been mentioned before when using worm drive hose clips (which replaced the earlier clips) to set the worms on opposite sides to balance the shaft .

Cheers, Tony.

[AustinWood]

When I was using the Pot & Trunnion shaft I found the rubber joint unsatisfactory.
It is difficult to fit as the pin has to be driven to one side to allow it to be fitted.
In use the gaiter kept coming off the pot and the worm drive hose clips weren't very satisfactory. In the end I used 'Ligarex' strapping which Citroen have used for years and still do on drive shafts. It's very effective, grips the gaiter evenly and has no large lumps to cause problems.
I gave up in the end and fitted the Hardy-Spicer shaft but have kept the original so it can be reinstated if a future owner wants strict originality.

[Dave Mann]

The Hardy Spicer includes it's splined sliding coupling Tony.

[Tony Press]

The Hardy Spicer includes it's splined sliding coupling Tony.

Understood - thanks.

Cheers, Tony

[Dave Wortley]

Way back on this site I remember someone abandoned the carden pot boot and fitted a disc in front of the pot as a water/muck thrower.