King pin eye faces on stub and beam axles.

[Alan]

You don't have to, Chris, you remove the top hat section from the bottom bush to create the space. I've looked at these for the Ulster but I worry about needle rollers exposed to the elements. However, isn't this a source of hard washers for a big 7 axle?

[Dennis Nicholas]

I can't think of an earthly reason to do this to an Austin Seven - a steel washer and a bit of grease now and then works just fine. And I very definitely would not remove metal from the axle stub to accommodate a bearing, however slim.

Chris, (and some of the others who have replied) just to confirm we are talking about the same thing....  It is the BIG 7 AXLE I am refurbishing.  This has 5/8 king pins and the bottom bush does not have a flange like the ordinary 7.  The thrust washer therefore has an ID of 5/8 inch and the O/D can be 1 1/8ish but may be slightly smaller. The underside of the axle beam eye is recessed by about 0.17 inches so the thrust sits partly in the recess and hence needs to be thick enough to protrude so the outer wall of the recess of the beam axle is clear of the stub axle eye face.

Sorry moderator...can the post subject be amended to read " BIG 7 king pin eye faces on stub and beam axle"  and the other associated subject  "BIG 7 king pin thrust washers"

Dennis

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I don't think oilite is something I'd choose for this application. At least one of our suppliers sells the correct hardened washers. I'd use those if I were you. I think they are cheaper as well.

Alan....why would you not chose?   what technical reason?  Here is blurb from Bowman .co.uk:-  (just for interest the manufacturing process of sintering is the means where the metal has the pours into which the lubricant soaks)


Materials
Oilite bearings are manufactured in three standard materials. 
1. Standard Oilite oil retaining tin bronze is the generally specified material. It gives good balance between strength, wear resistance, conformability and durability in operation. Ideal in a wide variety of applications where self-lubricating properties are required over a long period of time.
2. Super Oilite® is an iron copper material suited to high static loads and slow oscillatory motion.
3. Iron Oilite® are 100% iron oil-retaining bearings which provide an ideal solution in high stress low revolution applications.
Please see the Oilite® materials page for further technical details.

Dennis

[Bob Culver]

I guess with many newcomers now  with little acquaintance with traditional old cars and machinery a lot of reinventing is inevitable.
On other cars unsupported floating cylindrical oilite bushes are prone to break up.
Much can be done with blue and careful work with a very fine file. A new top hat bush slid over a kingpin could be used to apply blue (or equiv) to the axle face to test if this square.
I suppose it is desirable to reduce vertical float to keep dirt out and to reduce hydraulic hammering of the kingpin, end plugs etc; otherwise of little consequence, although wof inspectors do not like.
It is hardly a crime to pack the non thrust face with a soft washer filed to suit, or cut shim.
With the very low weight on front axle, the availability of moly grease,  the small Seven is a lesser candidate for further friction reduction.

For some,  Sevens are primarily the base for precision hobby. This is fine but the associated fancy standards if touted as the norm can deter those who just want a reliable car  functional as original .

[Chris KC]

When I said I wouldn't I was warning against the notion that it could be a good idea, rather than suggesting it was necessary! Points taken.

I'm with Alan & Bob on sintered materials - not knocking Oilite but these materials are inherently brittle. That's fine in an installation which is designed with such characteristics in mind. Come to that, needle rollers don't tend to fare too well in applications where they are static and subject to vibration. That's my two penn'orth...

[Annaustin]

Fitting needle roller thrusts were covered in an old post.
Refacing the axle eyes and inside the top of the stubs can be necessary when the king pins have worn loose.
Needle roller thrusts lighten up the slow speed steering a lot and they need shielding too.
If the castor is out the car wanders very freely!

[Derek Sheldon]

This is the first time that I have read this thread, somebody mention reinventing the wheel. I had the same problem with my Rosengart LR4 with knackered eye surfaces and came up with the same idea to use a tap reseating tool on an old king pin. The more difficult thing for me was that the LR4 has larger kingpins and bushes than the Austin seven, these had to be made in house.    

[Dennis Nicholas]

TAP SEAT CUTTER
I have found only one in a builders suppliers so far and that had 1/4 inch and 3/4 inch cutters......no good for big 7 1 1\16 inch required.........nor for A7 15/16 inch thrust faces (a7c told me the thrust size)

[Dennis Nicholas]

Sitrep.    Been ill with the coughing bug and too cold in garage so little progress.  However 4 axle eye faces ground flat and at 90 degrees to pin and 4 stub axle eye faces done too. Done using cylinder with pilot through it and valve grinding paste on end with pilot in electric drill chuck.
Hardened steel thrusts obtained (ex Morris).....these had to be reduced in diameter to fit in axle recess.  Done by clamping two at a time on a 5/8th bolt and small bolt down through middle held in drill. Bench grinder rotating and drill rotating in opposite direction. Very gently ground and highly skilled handsome face watching!      Washer of correct dia. clamped next to two being ground to show when correct dia. reached.
Now need to sort out packing out washers/shims to take up any play.
Hope to eventually put up photos of the two tools and write up process.

Dennis

[Greig Smith]

Hello Chaps

For what it's worth my racing bicycle headsets are tapered needle roller bearings, I've been using waterproof wheel bearing grease for many years and yes they do require periodic cleaning and re-greasing but the waterproof wheel bearing grease has kept them alive and rolling for good periods between rebuilding even with the odd very wet racing event, so If anyone is considering using those needle roller thrust bearings for anything like a TA/TB/TC or even a modified A7 application, I'd advise not using your regular garage grease in there...

As an aside I switched all our classics over to waterproof wheel bearing grease in the suspension points years ago & have had no issues at all.

My 0.02p's worth anyway...

Cheers
Greig

Sunny South Africa
Several 7's
Triumph Super 7
MG TC
Others

[Hedd Jones]

Is no one capable of using a file anymore?